badcopingmechanisms replied to your post “Patrick Star vs Man-Ray Meme: An Anti-Fujo One Act Play”
@windiewitch “LGBT people like m/m because it’s representation.” Jesus 😂😂😂 Actually I like m/m because I’m gay and enjoy getting off to two dudes doing it 🍆
Can we have both? :)
Oh yeah, absolutely!
We’re just saying that there’s nothing wrong with people enjoying something purely for pleasure reasons!
Anonymous asked:
antioverhaul-remade answered:
i know it’s a history and meaning and that’s how i know that a fujoshi is a woman who is a fan of yaoi, which is a genre that was originally targeted at straight women.
*sigh* No, you really don’t know anything about it’s history. It was marketed to women in general, not just straight women (in fact most fujoshi are not straight), because it’s a genre of romance. And romance is considered “a women’s” market. You don’t see many harlequin romance novels marketed towards men, do you?
Try @rottenboysclub (a Japanese speaking gay man) for some real info on the origins and info on the word.
“Japanese gay activist Satou Masaki criticized yaoi fans and artists in an open letter to the feminist zine Choisir in May 1992, writing that the genre was lacking in any accurate information about gay men and conveniently avoided the very real prejudice and discrimination that gay men faced as a part of society. More significantly, its portrayal of gay men as wealthy, handsome and well-educated was simply a vehicle for heterosexual female masturbation fantasies.”
In 1992? That’s almost 30 years ago! No shit it was lacking in accurate information, most people didn’t even have internet back then.
Like I said, go see rotten boys club. I don’t speak Japanese and I don’t have nearly as much info as he does about the subject.
https://rottenboysclub.tumblr.com/post/180349032314/since-you-seem-to-be-knowledgeable-do-you-know
I actually talked about the yaoi ronsou in-depth here!
Basically, Satou Masaki confused yaoi manga with yaoi fans and with professionally published BL (which are all different things) and with non-fandom fag hags who were objectifying and harassing gay men, only joining the discourse originally at the request of his friend. Once he actually read BL manga, he admitted he liked a lot of it, and said that as long as yaoi (as in the plotless fluff fancomic parodies) remained for personal pleasure (and wasn’t being used to harass irl gay men or put unrealistic expectations on us like the purity-obsessed folks do) he didn’t have a problem with it.
Fujo: So you like shipping.
Anti-Fujo: Yes.
Fujo: You mostly ship same-sex ships.
Anti-Fujo: That’s right.
Fujo: You create content like fics and fanart of sports anime ships and the like. A lot of non-canon things, that kind of stuff.
Anti-Fujo: Oh yeah.
Fujo: And most of those happen to be m/m ships.
Anti-Fujo: Mmmhmm.
Fujo: So it’s accurate to say you ship LGB+ ships, create content for it, and enjoy consuming said content
Anti-Fujo: Nothing inaccurate there.
Fujo: So you’re a fuojshi.
Anti-fujo: No, fujoshi fetishize gay men.
theres a difference between enjoying healthy lgbt content and straight up treating lgbt romance as inherently sexual? fuck off
There is literally nothing in this post about treating LGB (because ‘T’ is not a sexuality) ships at inherently sexual? Shipping isn’t an inherently sexual thing?? Someone should let @fujoshi-receipts know most people who identify as fujoshi are queer themselves.
You ever notice how antis build Straw Men like they own wheat farms?
Some of the comments in this thread truly astound me. Unless they’re completely asexual, most LGBT people in a romantic relationship are going to be porking on a regular basis just like any other couple. It’s not all just baking cookies and watching the sunset together, you know? Stop acting like human sexuality is this inherently dirty, exploitive, dehumanizing thing that your precious gays are far too pure and wholesome to participate in.
Also, not everybody who identifies as LGBT reads fanfic specifically for “representation” (which is a very shaky concept in and of itself). Plenty of us just want something to fap to.
Yep. This idea that the only way to be queer is to be pure and never have sexual urges is harmful and one of the many reasons anti philosophy is often tied to radical religious theology.
And believing that the only queer content that is acceptable is content that portrays us as pure and desexualized individuals is just—insane. I watch Killing Eve for the serial killer lesbian and psychological drama. Who cares if it’s not squeaky clean? Straight people are not the only group that can enjoy complex depictions of themselves.
Speaking as a gay man:
Gay sex is good, actually. Fuck the people saying shit like my husband and I aren’t “pure” or “wholesome” enough because we have dirty, nasty gay sex in the comfort of our own home.
Seriously, the only people “fetishizing” us (as in, putting us on a pedestal) are those who believe that gay people have to be “pure” and “wholesome” and harass us when we turn out to be regular guys that also enjoy having sex with other men and have kinks and so on.
There are two main types of fujoshi - one type that Japanese gay men don’t mind, and one type that Japanese men hate. Those people that obsess over purity are literally the kind of fujoshi that Japanese gay men actually have a problem with. The kind that ship and let ship and mind their own business? Don’t care, they’re considerate fujoshi. But the kind that demand that all gays are pure and perfect and wholesome with “noble, pure love” and force their ideals on you and they treat you like fictional characters and believe that fiction = reality??? Absolutely fucking hated. Inconsiderate type.
竜さんは「腐女子には2タイプある」と言います。ひとつは、先ほどの「崇高な純愛」愛好家のように、自分たちの理想を、現実のゲイに押し付けようとする無神経タイプ。ふたつめは、自分たちのファンタジーが現実のゲイを傷つけていないか気にしていて、気遣いができるタイプ。[source]
Anti fujos obsessed with sanitising mlm content? Japanese gay men hate you. You’re inconsiderate-type fujoshi/fudanshi/fujin and you don’t even realise it. You do more to damage the community by harassing us and demanding that we have to be exactly like your OTP than considerate-type fujoshi/fundashi/fujin who mind their business could ever do. Fiction isn’t reality and we aren’t fucking cartoon characters. Knock it off and let gay men live their life (which - sorry to disappoint - often includes all kinds of “evil” kinky gay sex).
travesyoutooz-deactivated202002 asked:
antis-delete-your-blogs-pls-thx answered:
Wow, and to think for a second you had a good post, OP.
The anti-fujo movement is racist, sexist, and transphobic. That really a look you want to enjoy?
lmao suck my toes bitch
So it is a look you want to enjoy?
guess so if it means i get to make fun of people who think fetishizing mlm relationships is ok
ohhh my god. oh my god is this conversation fucking real
fictional shit still harms real people. and you can fetishize mlm relationships, thats the same fucking thing as objectifying, its the fucking definition of fetishize. saying youre a fan of BL is even worse, by saying youre a FAN of BL thats literally proving my point that fujoshis fetishize mlm. its not a healthy way to represent mlm couples, and again, it harms real people. yaoi isnt supportive of lgbt people, its gross and harmful. hows about you go outside, hettie.
Fictional shit doesn’t harm real people, it can’t physically go out and attack you. People can use fiction as a tool to harm others, but people can also use a goddamn puppy as a tool to harm others, so.
No, it’s not. The definition of fetishise is “a form of sexual desire in which gratification is linked to an abnormal degree to a particular object, item of clothing, part of the body, etc.”. A human being, or two human beings, doing sexual things being portrayed in a sexual light is not fetishisation. Yaoi was made by LGBTQ people, not all BL portrays abusive relationships, it’s fucking racist to say otherwise.
Also I’m queer and NB but nice fucking try.
how the fuck is is racist, youre just throwing things at me now. yaoi is made by straight women for straight women. i dont care if youre q/eer, its harmful and sabotages the lgbt community. the yaoi community is gross, thats that.
Lo and behold, you’ve exposed yourself as woefully uninformed on this entire topic.
But just in case you can’t read, lemme sum it up for you:
- Anti-fujoshi is racist because “fujoshi” is a Japanese fandom term for any female fan of any mlm content. That’s literally what it has meant for decades and what it means still in Eastern fancommunities. By claiming all fujoshi objectify gay men, you’re declaring every single Japanese female fan of mlm content to be objectifying gay men. That’s racist and a pretty blatant example of appropriating something from a foreign culture for your own purposes - specifically negative purposes, in this case.
- “Yaoi”, btw, is a word for romantic parodies of the intense no-homo bromances that were popular in fiction at the time. Western fandom has been applying it to things that aren’t originally “yaoi”. You seem aware of the more accurate term “BL”, yet you continue to use them interchangeably.
- BL itself is basically a marketing category. It’s marketed to women, yes, because it’s about romance. Romantic fiction in Japan in general is marketed towards women! And BL as a content category is as varied as “LGBT+ Fiction” and “Young Adult” are. You could get the most wholesome fluff ever, or you could get a horrible offensive mess. And yet that’s not inherent to the entire genre…
- Quoting user @rottenboysclub now: “There are a good number of well-known lesbian fujoshi. […] According to gay mangaka Gengoroh Tagame, a lot of fujoshi and BL mangaka may appear as cis het women on paper, but in actuality are closeted lesbians, bisexuals, trans men, x-gender, and even some who were writing under a pen-name and later turned out to be cis gay MEN. [source]”
- And again: “In addition, according to various demographic surveys, about half (50%!) of female BL readers identify as non-cishet in some way.“
- In addition, you didn’t ask about this specifically, surprisingly, but TERFs are actively spreading anti-fujoshi rhetoric specifically so they can call trans men “fujoshi” (or in other words, misgender them) and accuse mlm fiction for “making” those trans men be men and not women. (source 1 and source 2, shoutout to rbc for linking those).
In conclusion: stop slandering the entire East-Asian mlm fandom and playing into transphobes’ hands because you never bothered to look beyond your own nose. Call a homophobe a homophobe and leave your misinformed ideas about terms from other cultures out of it. Because shockingly, enforcing your own negative made-up meanings on a word from another culture, ignoring and erasing that word’s actual meaning, and then punishing everyone who does use the real meaning, is racist.
travesyoutooz-deactivated202002 asked:
antis-delete-your-blogs-pls-thx answered:
Wow, and to think for a second you had a good post, OP.
The anti-fujo movement is racist, sexist, and transphobic. That really a look you want to enjoy?
lmao suck my toes bitch
So it is a look you want to enjoy?
guess so if it means i get to make fun of people who think fetishizing mlm relationships is ok
ohhh my god. oh my god is this conversation fucking real
fictional shit still harms real people. and you can fetishize mlm relationships, thats the same fucking thing as objectifying, its the fucking definition of fetishize. saying youre a fan of BL is even worse, by saying youre a FAN of BL thats literally proving my point that fujoshis fetishize mlm. its not a healthy way to represent mlm couples, and again, it harms real people. yaoi isnt supportive of lgbt people, its gross and harmful. hows about you go outside, hettie.
Fictional shit doesn’t harm real people, it can’t physically go out and attack you. People can use fiction as a tool to harm others, but people can also use a goddamn puppy as a tool to harm others, so.
No, it’s not. The definition of fetishise is “a form of sexual desire in which gratification is linked to an abnormal degree to a particular object, item of clothing, part of the body, etc.”. A human being, or two human beings, doing sexual things being portrayed in a sexual light is not fetishisation. Yaoi was made by LGBTQ people, not all BL portrays abusive relationships, it’s fucking racist to say otherwise.
Also I’m queer and NB but nice fucking try.
how the fuck is is racist, youre just throwing things at me now. yaoi is made by straight women for straight women. i dont care if youre q/eer, its harmful and sabotages the lgbt community. the yaoi community is gross, thats that.
It’s racist because fujoshi is a Japanese term you’ve completely misappropriated to mean, in your eyes, something homophobic and shameful. To apply all problematic tropes in romance media (which exist) to all yaoi, the Japanese term for fictional MLM relationships, implies that Japan has never created a nuanced or realistic portrayal of gay men, and that all their media is gross and homophobic. That’s fucking racist.
Also, yaoi is made primarily by queer people, but even if it weren’t the case, straight women being aroused by two men having sex is literally completely normal and a natural response?
@rottenboysclub can explain from a more nuanced perspective.
All of what @antis-delete-your-blogs-pls-thx is saying is correct.
In Japanese, fujoshi just means a woman has at least one fictional mxm ship. It’s a fandom term. Fujoshi started as a misogynistic insult on 2ch to say that women who are interested in any kind of fictional mlm shipping content are unsuitable for marriage (basically not a yamato nadeshiko), and rotten in the head.[Source](links to abstract, you can read the full paper by clicking html at the side there)
Fujoshi has since been reclaimed and, when used as a fandom term, means the following (translated from Japanese):
“腐女子（ふじょし）とは、やおいやボーイズラブ（BL）と呼ばれる男性同士の恋愛を扱った小説や漫画などを好む女性のことである。“[Source]
“Fujoshi is women who like novels, manga, etc. that deal with male-male love, such as yaoi or BL. [usage of ya here implies that it’s not limited to BL/yaoi, but simply includes it]
”男性同士の同性愛が描かれた作を好む女性を指す呼称のひとつ。“[Source]
“A word used to refer to a woman who like works depicting male-male love.”
The current anti-fujoshi movement on this site was spearheaded by TERFs, as a way to insult trans men and accuse them of being “females fetishising gay relationships”. Using fujoshi in this way (with the definition of “females fetishising gay relationships”, rather than the Japanese definition) is a TERF dogwhistle for trans mlm. [Sources here]
More sources for bullet points number 4 and 5:
TLDR: I’m just a clueless gay man and I don’t know a thing about your boku no big hero six academy discourse, but I do have a problem with your attitude. Don’t throw out misogynistic slurs or sexual threats, and don’t misgender people just because you were proven wrong on the internet. Also there are lots of sources because you are completely and utterly wrong about pretty much everything you said.
This has got to be the worst fandom I’ve ever been in since voltron. Atleast problematic ships were heavily discouraged over there and fujos were told to fuck off. But defending and abusive relationships like catra and Adora and allowing it to top fandom metrics is beyond disgusting. It’s like bakudeku with women.
Just Anti Things: I have no idea what fujoshi means, also I’m apparently on some pretty strong drugs if I think that voltron is an example of a good fandom
OP I have some news for you, no fandom is good, no matter what the show/book/movie is about, the fandom will always be shit, even the most chilled fandom in the world has its grand turds here and there. She-Ra is no exception, the fandom for this show was shit loooong before the first season even aired on Netflix. However, here is a hard pill for you, people like you ruin fandoms, and it’s because of your inability to not harass someone over fiction, the inability to not know what words mean, and the inability to know the difference between a complicated relationship and an abusive relationship.
“The inability to know what words mean”
Did I harass someone? I’m not even posting on the fandoms tags. I’m only discouraging straight women who blindly jack off to tlhe things they consume.
Discouraging straight women who blindly jack off to things they- WHY IS THAT ANY OF YOU BUSINESS? That also counts as harassment because that is none of your god damn problem and it’s fucking dictative. Fucking leave people a lone for god sakes. Look up what fujoshi means, stop spelling it as “fujoshis” too because their is no plural in Japanese words, learn the difference between complicated and abusive, just get a fucking dictionary. Jesus for a young blog it’s already a damn train wreck.
@rottenboysclub Care to give this young blog a history lesson on what fujoshi means?
We’ve asked men to be critical of the things they consume, certain acts are the result of bad parenting or patriarchy, or certain acts promote them. A teenage boy wouldn’t know why he likes dominating people so much and disempowering women, he wouldn’t even question it. He does it most likely because of our society still valuing master-slave like relationships, ie. Women being submissive and obedient to men. Yes women can also perpetuate these kind of social dynamics by chasing after aggressive men.
I don’t need a history lesson on the word fujoshiss. I know it’s a reclaimed word for “Rotten woman”, used by women who liked taboo porn.
My analysis isn’t based on historical contexts, it’s based on now. Fujoshis have ruined people’s lives and qualify to end up in one of those sjw cringe compilations. They’ve a reputation on not being notified about LGBT issues and gawking at gay couples like they are zoo animals.
You lost me at critically thinking about what you like and what turns you on. It’s still none of your business to tell people what to do about what turns them on and fun fact, lots of women actually enjoy being submissive regardless of if they’re in a straight or lesbian relationship. They just like it, it’s not that deep and it’s not destroying society as a whole.
Yes you do, because you keep ending it as plural, that’s bastardizing Japanese language and it wasn’t used by women, it was created by Japanese incel’s bitching about women liking yaoi and bl, it’s roots are mysogynistic and sexist.
You really should include analyst with historical contexts as well, because not only does ignoring it make the analyst look lazy as all hell, but everything you just claim fujoshi of doing is from 2008, when fujoshi were at their worse. Time and time there are bad eggs in the fujoshi community but they have become so rare.
I don’t need a history lesson on the word fujoshiss. I know it’s a reclaimed word for “Rotten woman”, used by women who liked taboo porn.
That’s not what it means.
Fujoshi is a Japanese term that simply means a woman that is a fan of mlm ships in fiction. Said woman could be straight, lesbian, bisexual, trans etc. - it isn’t specified. It doesn’t specify the type of mlm ships she has, or how she ships them. Said woman could be a casual fan, as not all fujoshi are even considered otaku (hardcore fans / nerdy fans). If a woman even has a single mlm ship, she is considered a fujoshi.
Himejoshi is the wlw equivalent, meaning a woman that is a fan of wlw ships in fiction.
The following is copy-pasted from previous replies, because I’m not writing it all out again:
_________________________________________________________
Fujoshi started as a misogynistic insult on 2ch to say that women who are interested in any kind of fictional mlm shipping content are unsuitable for marriage (basically not a yamato nadeshiko), and rotten in the head. [Source] (links to abstract, you can read the full paper by clicking html at the side there)
Fujoshi has since been reclaimed and, when used as a fandom term, means the following (translated from Japanese):
“腐女子（ふじょし）とは、やおいやボーイズラブ（BL）と呼ばれる男性同士の恋愛を扱った小説や漫画などを好む女性のことである。“
“Fujoshi is women who like novels, manga, etc. that deal with male-male love, such as yaoi or BL. [usage of ya here implies that it’s not limited to BL/yaoi, but simply includes it]”
男性同士の同性愛が描かれた作を好む女性を指す呼称のひとつ。
“A word used to refer to a woman who like works depicting male-male love.”
Fujoshi only means “rotten girl” if you google-translate it. In other words, I consider it somewhat of a mistranslation as the ‘fu’ character doesn’t actually carry connotations of bad behaviour like the word “rotten” does in English. The fu character is also used in tofu - directly translated it means “fermented bean”. So I think fujoshi is probably better translated as “fermentation girl” and the reason it was termed as such has more to do with the fact that (when it was originally used to refer to slash fangirls) these women would “ferment” / change the “product to be consumed” (anime series), so that it would be unpalatable for the cishet male viewer, by making two or more male characters in love with one another. In other words, it’s a food pun. This is seen with other fujoshi terms such as “mapodoufu” (spicy tofu in mince) and “nama” (raw, uncooked or unpreserved food). I have more sources on the etymology here.
The current anti-fujoshi movement on this site was spearheaded by TERFs, as a way to insult trans men and accuse them of being “females fetishising gay relationships”. Using fujoshi in this way (with the definition of “females fetishising gay relationships”, rather than the Japanese definition) is a TERF dogwhistle for trans mlm.[Sources here]
There are a good number of well-known lesbian fujoshi. Kabi Nagata and Akiko Mizoguchi immediately spring to mind, and they’re just some who are out. According to gay mangaka Gengoroh Tagame, a lot of fujoshi and BL mangaka may appear as cis het women on paper, but in actuality are closeted lesbians, bisexuals, trans men, x-gender, and even some who were writing under a pen-name and later turned out to be cis gay MEN. [source]
In addition, according to various demographic surveys, about half (50%!) of female BL readers identify as non-cishet in some way.
Sources:
AND even if the majority of fujoshi were cishet (which they aren’t), I and many other queer men, including queer Japanese men, don’t consider it to inherently be homophobic or fetishistic for them to like slash.
_________________________________________________________
We’ve asked men to be critical of the things they consume, certain acts are the result of bad parenting or patriarchy, or certain acts promote them. A teenage boy wouldn’t know why he likes dominating people so much and disempowering women, he wouldn’t even question it. He does it most likely because of our society still valuing master-slave like relationships, ie. Women being submissive and obedient to men.
I’m not sure if you’re aware, but the wording here uses a lot of SWERF and sex-negative dogwhistles. X-critical and the associated communities are part of Radical Feminism. That doesn’t mean we can’t look at something problematic in our society and criticise it (obviously) but the RF communities themselves and how they approach this criticism go about it in all the wrong ways. With regards to this teenager’s behaviour: Are we talking about in society in general, or about who’s topping or bottoming in the bedroom? Because the master-slave comment makes me thing it’s either a comparison to the enslavement of Black Americans, or talking about BDSM dynamics. Either way is… pretty insensitive wording at best.
Yes women can also perpetuate these kind of social dynamics by chasing after aggressive men.
Oppression is a societal institution, not based on a single individual. Oppression occurs when one group, based on an aspect of their identity, is elevated by society and the other (those not in said group) is subjugated by laws, stereotypes and social rules and norms. Oppression doesn’t go both ways. Women don’t perpetuate their own oppression simply by following the social rules that they are expected to follow. This is straight-up victim blaming.
Also, that whole “they don’t know anything about LGBT issues” ? Mostly because the fujoshi you’re talking about happen to be sheltered baby gays, questioning youth, and allies - kids who haven’t yet been taught the proper way to interact with members of the LGBT+ community, or about LGBT+ history. Because we live in a homophobic / transphobic society that goes out of its way to hide that stuff from “impressionable children’s minds”.
None of us come out the womb as having a pure and perfect understanding of the world, so don’t blame an excited 14 year old seeing two men kiss for the first time in real life, for a societal failure of not introducing them to gay role models sooner, or for having internalised prejudice about the community. Even as adults we have to keep unlearning that shit. Nobody’s perfect, and we’re allowed to grow and change into better versions of ourselves as we get older.
History is important. Just remember the old adage: Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.
Anonymous asked:
Idk if this is relevant or not to the anti-fujo movement, but I thought it was funny. I’ve noticed a trend of people commenting on fics as “Jesus” telling fic writers they’re not going to heaven for what they wrote. It even happened to me on my self indulgent darkfic? I can’t help but laugh cause.. they say us fujin call what we do sinning… then they imply what we do /is/ sinning.. by posing as fuckin Jesus. I unno, thought I’d share.
I’ve also noticed people saying stuff like “Go to church” or “Y’all need Jesus” wrt ships or sexy pictures/fics (or even just things they think are “weird”) which is, to me, more fucked up than someone saying “I’m sinning” as it’s other people making judgements about you rather than you poking fun at yourself. Not to mention how othering it is to non-Christian creators in a culturally Christian-dominant culture (Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist et al.) and those who weren’t even raised in a culturally Christian-dominant culture (e.g. Japan, which is mainly Shinto-Buddhist)
Like, buddy, I was unofficially excommunicated from the Catholic church when I was 13 for being unapologetically gay, I’m not going back there because some rando on the internet doesn’t like a picture I reblogged of two cartoon characters kissing and thinks it’s something I need to beg for forgiveness for
Just Anti Things: they’re all straight women pretending to be bi
@rottenboysclub check out this dumpster fire
It’s a misogynist strawwoman so you can feel good about hating female-identified or adjacent people for having interests.
I’m sorry you want to pretend it’s 2008 and yaoi paddles are still a thing, but bitching about yaoi was generally thinly-veiled sexism then and it’s even more thinly-veiled now.
op can u shut up lmao
Nah. Prove to me that your strawwoman exists. Because I’m a queer dude who’s been into yaoi for 20 years and that shit hasn’t been even remotely common in at least a decade.
u rlly out here thinkin that people who dislike fujoshi culture think this is the main issue we have???
anyways i can’t take you seriously when you (1) can’t admit that you’re white (2) you’re over 30 and havent gotten out of something most teens realize is weird (3) you literally have a porn blog
Oh no. ~An adult likes sexual fantasies and I have a problem with their ethnic background. This clearly means they’re wrong about something unrelated that I still haven’t proven.~
Also “most teens realize is weird”— I have no idea what this is referring to (yaoi? M/m media is quite popular. Porn? I got some news for you about most teenagers.) And anyway, I don’t live my life dictated by what teenagers think is “weird” or not, and tbh neither should anyone else. Even teenagers.
Your fujoshi strawwoman still doesn’t exist.
1) my issue with you calling yourself “white-passing/conditionally white” has to do with the fact that you’re refusing to acknowledge how you’re positioned/racialized and thus don’t analyze the power difference you have (which shows in the fact that you have race fantasies lmao?!?) your actions are harmful towards actual Jews of color and you need to acknowledge it
2) Idk where even to begin addressing all of this bc ur misunderstanding someo f what I wrote, but you’ve rendered yourself lacking in any credibility and I don’t need to prove anything to someone who doesn’t analyze how they contribute to racism and rape culture and somehow thinks that criticizing people who do so are the actual misogynists.
1) Are you a Jew of color? Do you have any idea about my experiences with Jews of color? Do you spend any time on my blog paying attention to the way I interact with other Jewish people? You do not get to police my identity, and you certainly don’t get to police my identity in a frivolous argument about the definition of the word “fujoshi”.
2) I absolutely analyze how I contribute to racism and rape culture. I simply came to a different conclusion than you.
And your fujoshi strawwoman still doesn’t exist.
1) watch 11:05 to 18:00
2) ive lichrally been on the internet since i was 8 and have been on the internet for the entirety of my anime phase and yaoi fangirls reducing mlm relationships to nothing but “butt smex OwO” and “butt rape lolz!!!” and being like “IM SINNING LMAOOOO” whenever they look at/draw/write/whatever yaoi or nsfw gay shit was (and still is) a very real thing…………………like why would so many ppl just….. mass-fabricate a fake thing……….lol????????
3) biel is indeed very much jewish and very much of colour why else would they touch on this skdjfkdshf
4) you do crack
5) you reeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaally dont analyze shit thats why you came to your “different conclusion” sjkdfhkjsd???
6)
7) you! do! crack!
SOME ACTUAL QUOTES FROM YOUR AMERICAN-DIRECTED AND CREATED FUCKING VICE DOCUMENTARY.:
“If I were a young gay man, I’d look at this and be interested.” - The gay dude whose name I don’t know, flipping through yaoi manga
“Fujoshi literally means ‘rotten women’ and refers to fans of yaoi comics.” - Ellen Page narrating that women who like any sort of BL are fujoshi.
“We fujoshi recognize that homosexuality exists and it is beautiful.” - Renge
Like, did you not notice that the gay guy was having a fucking BLAST with those ladies? They they’re super super gay friendly, and that’s the point? Do you not understand that in Japan the stereotype of fujoshi are that they’re bi or queer themselves? Or that… you know. A Vice documentary starring Ellen Page might not have the most nuanced read on what women who like this stuff are like?
And… Don’t have the “I have been on the internet since” argument with me. I was on fucking AOL. I have literally been on the internet since it became something kids COULD get on. I ALSO lived through the “LOL butt smex” era. And it was over a goddamn decade ago, you fucking walnut.
Your friend may be Jewish but she brought up my ethnicity and identification totally unwarranted to win some sort of point in this argument, after a weekend where eleven Jews were murdered for being Jewish. So tbh, she needs to go have a conversation with her rabbi about lashon hara and fuck right the hell off.
@rottenboysclub Can I just kick this to you and go into a corner somewhere?
I believe what Challahchic was referring to in the OP was the idea of this fujoshi strawman calling the ships her “sinful gay babies,” and calling the characters themselves sinful for being gay, which, in all my years, I have never come across. I have seen “my babies” and “I’m sinning” as separate concepts, but never together. Bringing up his Jewish ethnicity was completely inappropriate and unnecessary for this conversion.
AFAIK The “I’m sinning” phrase used in western fandom stuff has always referred to women engaging in sexual things, not the characters sinning for being gay. (It’s used with mxf pairings, originally) Many people realised that this could be taken the wrong way when referring to those with gay ships, so a lot of people have dropped using it, and I personally haven’t seen it used unironically since 2012.
This phenomenon is really limited to English-speaking western slash fandom, usually with people who are culturally Christian, and it isn’t really a thing in eastern fu-fandoms. In other words, it’s not a “fujoshi” thing, it’s a western fandom thing. In English, even outside of fandom, joking about sinning is really common in general.
I was raised Catholic when I was a young lad, and I make jokes about sinning and going to hell because I, myself, am gay, and I’m allowed to make facetious jokes about homophobia, just like a women is allowed to make facetious jokes about misogyny and purity culture.
P.S. Don’t joke about drug addiction, that shit ruins lives.
Challahchic’s posts are brilliant, but I assume the poor bloke got purged this week :( do you know if he’s remade a blog again?
As for everything else: 👍👌
I suggest checking @find-me-at-x for peoples new accounts!
I’m on mobile so I can check is photo submissions are allowed, but there’s this I guess.
I feel deeply sorry this person went through that but this is… literally stuff anti fujos do constantly.
regarding the abuse stuff. I’ve had people say that to me when I was living as a woman, in a relationship with a man. It’s almost like…. most people don’t take abuse seriously, regardless of if they are fujoshi or not! I honestly wish issues like dismissing abuse, sexual comments towards minors, ableism and other forms of harassment was just a fujoshi thing, they’d be so much easier to solve if that were the case.
